In 1973, senior journalist Vinayak Gokhale interviewed Balasaheb Deoras at the Dr Hedgewar Bhawan in Nagpur. Balasaheb’s personal secretary Dr Aabaji Thatte and representative of Maharashtra Times Keshavrao Potdar were also present. The interview was carried in Kirloskar magazine in 1973
Excerpts;
In your inaugural address after taking over as the RSS sarsanghchalak you had said that you never expected this post to be offered to you. Seeing your
seniority, dedication and popularity among swayamsewaks it was but natural that this post be given to you. So why were you surprised?
I had not thought of it or it surprised me, it was all because of health reasons. I had never considered myself qualitatively less qualified than what my colleagues are. But my health has not been well. I am a patient of Blood Pressure and Guruji knew about it. So I thought this responsibility would not be given to me.
As you have been a swayamsewak since childhood, I want to ask you that Mussoilini’s fascist revolution was very popular in India before 1925. Is it true that Dr Hedgewar was influenced by it, following which the RSS was formed? How much reference does that movement find in the addresses of Doctorji?
The RSS was formed in 1925. I joined the RSS in 1926. I remained in his company for the maximum time. Not even by mistake did I ever hear the word Mussolini or fascist movement from him. Thinking of the RSS is completely rooted in the native soil. It was not that the youth was not anxious about Fascism or Communism. But about that for the first time I heard from Kanade Shastri from Buldhana. He delivered a lecture on it at Nagpur. There was a huge crowd. We would also go to such lectures. But I didn’t see any
influence of Fascism on Doctorji’s thinking.
At an early age you offered your services to the RSS. What was there in your mind then? The RSS was too small as an organisation, so were you influenced by Doctorji’s words or that you were convinced that this was the only course to serve the nation, so you decided to join it?
It was both. The patronage of Doctorji was certainly one aspect of it. The way he looked after us it was natural that whatever he spoke became a
“Veda-Vakya” (wisdom of Vedas) for us. But at the same time, importance of revolutionary organisations had also sunk in our hearts. I still remember the day Bhagat Singh was arrested. We also wanted to do something like Bhagat Singh and Rajguru. Doctorji came to know about this feeling in us. After that, for a long time there was thinking on it and the RSS was formed. For 8-10 days he would daily call us to his house in the evening, and would discuss what such revolutionaries could achieve, the limitations they had and what was the need to unite the entire society. He would make us understand it all. In fact, it was during those meetings that I realised how great Doctorji was. After that, me and many of my colleagues submitted ourselves to the service of the RSS. It was clear to us then that only a Hindu
organisation can be the only mantra for serving the nation.
The Partition of India is a blot on our modern history. It is true that the RSS rendered invaluable service to the refugees from Sindh and Punjab. But it is surprising that with so much youth strength with it, the RSS never tried to stop the partition of the country. Did seniors in the RSS deliberate on how could the partition be averted? I could never know this secret, that’s why I am asking you.
I would very categorically accept it that the way you are expecting, the adverse impact the partition on the future of country was never discussed among the seniors of RSS. To say it truthfully it was an
unexpected and a sudden calamity for us. We were shocked and surprised. You may say that we fell short of contemplating on a matter of wide-ranging implications. I remember I was touring the border state and Punjab in March 1947, when the Muslim League had launched “direct action” or had started communal riots. So to look after Hindu families, to help them and protect them became the focus of our task which we performed diligently.
The youth today finds the Hindu mantra of the RSS very attractive, but the youth is not attracted to its working style or the Shakhas. Do you think there is any need to change the working style of the RSS to attract the youth?
This I would accept that the youth does not find the programmes of the RSS attractive. But we are thinking about making changes in our
programmes and functions to attract the youth. Not just now, in fact this thought has been alive even during the times of the Guruji. The RSS has programmes like “dand”, “sanchalan”, “kabaddi”. All such
programmes have given us success, but we are not emotionally attached to them. We are not allergic to games which have foreign origin. The route march,
uniform, band etc have been part of the Sangh progammes since inception. Initially, the first part of the RSS prayer was in Marathi and the second part in Hindi. At the end slogans for “Bajrang Bali”, “Balbhim”, “Ramdas Swami” were raised. It was during Dr Hedgewar’s times only that the entire prayer was rephrased in Sanskrit, which continues till date. At the end we only say “Bharat Mata ki Jai”. But is the youth attracted to the games or the physical exercises? We fail to understand this. How many boys come to play cricket, hockey or football in the college grounds? How many youths turn up at the Vyayamshalas (traditional wrestling centres)? We don’t just want crowd. We want to increase the number, but our main aim is to nurture the minds of youth. We can’t forget this.
I would touch a sensitive topic now. Three-four years back Golwalkar Guruji had given an interview on ‘Varna-system’ which caused lot of debate in Maharashtra. Does the RSS really have a different
viewpoint on the matter?
Guruji had delivered a lecture on Varna-system. But everybody has his own way of articulating things. Guruji had a deep insights about our ancient literature and dharma. That’s why he would refer to ancient examples. I would give you examples of Germany, Israel and Indonesia. Guruji would say things in a way that values of our ancient tradition remained intact. Still, he would call today’s sytem a chaotic system.
But what does the RSS think about the
‘Varna-system’?
Please write it clearly, the RSS does not believe in any kind of ‘Varna-system’.
In the ‘Varna-system’ the biggest problem is that of untouchability and social inequality. Will it be impossible to end it without a special kind of revolution? Does the RSS has any such plan for a revolution?
Everybody has accepted that in the RSS there is nothing like untouchability and caste discrimination. We have a swayamsevak by the name of Badhia. He belongs to the Beldar caste. We got to know about it incidentally after many years. We had never asked him about his caste. In our house we had a conservative atmosphere, but after joining the RSS I told my mother that anybody who would join me on meals would sit by my side and they would not pick up their plate. A large number of so-called
untouchables had food at my place. The reason is that in the RSS programmes untouchables are not
discriminated against. There is no difference between touchable and untouchable. Remember this is almost a 2000-4000 years old problem. We don’t need fury and stunts to resolve it. There have been number of agitations against it, yet untouchability prevails. When we run after untouchables, they get suspicious. It is but natural. That is why the way RSS addresses it, is more rewarding, I feel. Still I agree that the speed of transformation must
accelerate. I feel that the increase of RSS “shakhas” in the so-called untouchable localities can help resolve this problem in a big way.
The RSS might not be against the change, but its role has been passive. It seems the RSS is not reformative. One does not see any propagation on issues like inter-caste marriages or the tradition of dowry in the newspapers or magazines being brought out by the RSS office-bearers or its supporters?
One thing must be kept in mind about the RSS. That there is no difference between what is said and what is acted upon. How many of those drumbeating about inter
caste-marriages would wed their daughters out of their caste? In our Deoras family there were inter-caste
marriages and there was opposition to it. But me and Bhau (Bhaurao Deoras) stood by such weddings. When we sent an invitation to Guruji about this inter-caste
marriage, he especially came to attend it. Still, I admit that the number of people in favour of inter-caste marriages should increase.
The RSS feels that the Muslim minority should become part of the mainstream. What steps does the RSS think about taking in this direction?
We agree that the minorities should become part of the mainstream. It is our responsibility. We feel that the organisation of the Hindu society could only be its panacea. The society does not work with logics. That is why the policy of appeasement, providing facilities has borne bitter fruits.
The situation in the country is that the Congress would only be building its future. And the Congress does look to be in a healthy condition. Sardar Patel was always worried about it. That’s why he had suggested that the RSS swayamsewaks should join the Congress. The RSS swayamsewaks should join the Congress to make the administration efficient. Would you suggest something like that?
Not at all. What is the guarantee that the Congress would be purified after the RSS swayamsewaks join it? It is for the Congressmen only to cleanse the party. No
organisation can be cleansed with outsiders. But if some RSS swamasewaks want to join the Congress, we have no objection.
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